Seb (00:00)

Hi everybody and welcome to this episode of Safetytech Accelerator’s Insight Series. My name’s Seb Corby, I’m a Principal Consultant and I’m going to be interviewing Roly Latif from Heathrow Airport about why he’s chosen to start the OSHX Innovation Lab and why this is such an important program now.

 

Welcome. I start by asking you to just introduce yourself, who you are and what role that you do.

 

Roly (00:30)

Yeah, sure. So I’m Roly Latif I’m Head of Health and Safety for all of our infrastructure programs at Heathrow. And I’ve been there for 10 years, a great place to work. And yeah, happy to be part of this conversation.

 

Seb (00:48)

So tell us about OSHX and maybe what’s prompted you to make such a statement. It’s a big ambition of what we want to do with OSHX. So what’s kind of caused you now to make this step?

 

Roly (01:04)

Yeah, I think I’m involved in quite a lot of groups that have around sort of discussions around sort of AI and robotics and innovation. I3P in the past and sort of and involved with safety tech accelerating some of the sandboxes. I guess for me, they’re fantastic, but I think sometimes they turn into a conversational group and it’s great to have those conversations. But actually it’s a good opportunity, I think, to drive some action.

 

and sort of see where we can get some of that talking actually into some structure and see some real tangible output. So I think that for me is one of the reasons that I’m really excited about working with Safetytech Accelerator and the OSHX program.

 

Seb (01:49)

So there’s a lot of chat, there’s a lot of conversations, but maybe not enough doing. Is that a fair summation?

 

Roly (01:56)

Yeah,

 

yeah, so I think seeing things actually, you know, sort of come into a point where we’re implementing them and, you know, actually making a difference is where I see the exciting challenge within the OSHX is how we can see some of those conversations that we have, those great, you know, rich ideas come into fruition and look, let’s do this. And this is as a result of what we’ve been doing in the past. So that’s the bit that I really think that we could benefit from.

 

Seb (02:25)

And is this an important time in Heathrow’s journey? You’ve obviously got potentially a lot of capital works coming up. Is this a bit of a pivotal point?

 

Roly (02:35)

Yeah, definitely. think, you know, all of the conversations that we’re having now at Heathrow is about how much we are investing in the airport. We’re just kind of two, another two years left of our current regulatory period. You know, there’s a huge amount of investment to be made in the next regulatory period, which we call in H8. And amongst all of that as well, we’re looking at redeveloping the airport within our existing footprints of how we can improve.

 

and increase capacity and make passenger experience a lot better. So the only way we’re going to do that is by looking at innovative ways to do that. And that’s either going to be through modern methods of construction or just kind of extended working hours. But all of that is all around the constraints that we’ve got around an operational airport. So first and foremost, the operation, we have to obviously keep

 

keep that safe, but actually looking at ideas and ways of increasing productivity and efficiency for our infrastructure is the only way we’re going to deliver that massive capital portfolio in the next 10, 15, 20 years.

 

Seb (03:46)

So what’s innovation been like so far? Do you feel that Heathrow has been doing a lot of innovation? Is it been working with a lot of tech companies or is it something you want to ramp up or maybe you’ve been doing it but maybe haven’t seen the success that you’d like?

 

Roly (03:46)

Yeah, I think we, you know, I think if I’m honest, I think Heathrow could improve on its innovation mindset. We’ve got a very small, but great team that’s working within innovation, within solutions. So, you know, the business comes up with a solution or problem that they need to solve. Our solutions team get hold of that. Now within that is a small team that looks at innovation.

 

So again, at the moment there, it’s very much a light touch. It’s about sort of exploring different ways of managing data, if that makes sense, and what we can get from data. So it’s very much kind of data driven and what the information we can get from that. I guess where we’re not sort of looking is more around sort of AI and co-bots and actually building or using AI to build robots and co-bots to help us do those things rather than manage that data. I think that’s where I’d…

 

It’d be great to see a sort of shift about how we can use that AI to sort of, you know, either in a drone technology, you know, to start laying bricks at high level or whatever we’re trying to do. I think that’s the opportunity that I’d like to see is how we, how we modernize a lot of the processes and procedures and construction techniques that we do. And, know, with a background of an aging workforce and people just not coming into construction. All of those challenges is how.

 

we can really kind of come up with some ideas to say, do you know what, this really works? Because I think at the moment still we’re on the sort of a level path of innovation, if that makes sense. We’re using things like robotic dogs and at the moment everyone is still getting excited about seeing a robotic dog, but that stuff is kind of just now, ⁓ first generation of innovation. So it’s where we can push the boundaries.

 

Seb (05:56)

So talk to me a little bit about your setup. So obviously Heathrow is in quite a unique position in terms of it’s got a big capital program coming up. You’re not a contractor, you’re a client in the perception of many. You have the assets, you’re driving the strategy, the plan, and you have a big supply chain. So what is it you kind of want to achieve or must do for your supply chain and how does

 

Seb (06:25)

How does your relationship work with the contract who are ultimately a lot of the time going to be the people that need to take on this innovation? What do you want to do for them? Maybe what are you expecting from them?

 

Roly (06:31)

Yeah, I think what we’ve traditionally done very well at Heathrow and we’ve done in the past and we still do and we improve on that is ⁓ bring on collaboration with our partners. I mean, that’s why we call them our delivery partners. They’re not our contractors, they’re our delivery partners. So they actually work together, work with Heathrow to get the best outcomes from delivering our capital projects or programs.

And we don’t do that on a commercial basis. We don’t say, right, you’ve all got a tender for this work and whoever gets the lowest cost and therefore you’ll win the project. We sort of set them up for success in terms of giving them a portfolio of work where they can plan and work with Heathrow to deliver that in the best possible way, the safest possible way, the most efficient possible way. Where we constantly set them the challenge of is what improvement can you bring and where do Heathrow fit into that as a forward looking client? Heathrow in the past has always been a client that has been pushing the boundaries with these past delivery directors that have been parts of the construction leadership group and the infrastructure clients leadership group. We’re always on the front foot of driving the industry as a general.

 

So, but I think where we’ve got the opportunity here is to really get our supply chain to focus on what the commercial benefits of some use and some technology can be in terms of, you know, delivering, you know, our projects quicker, ⁓ at a better quality, more consistently. And just, I guess, is getting them into the mindset of thinking outside of actually how we always built stuff.

 

And how is it that we’ve always done things? And I always look at, I always talk about an analogy that when I worked in my previous job, it was in a production factory. And we were making sort of 3000 or 3 million products every single day. And we were really industrialising. And I always used to joke that if you took somebody from 2000 years ago and plot them in that environment, you’d blow their mind and stuff some of the stuff that you were doing.

 

But if you took them and put them on a construction site, they’ll still know what you’re doing. You know, we’re digging holes, we’re pouring concrete, you know, we’re doing the same things that we’ve always done. So how can we use this innovation? How can we work with our supply chain? Because they’re obviously, you know, they must be doing this in within their organisations. They must be looking at how to do things better, quicker, more efficiently. It’s how the Heathrow enabled that and how can we use the environment at Heathrow to really kind of test some of those, the great work that they’re doing in this huge sandbox that we’ve got Heathrow and looking at how we can do this stuff and make it more efficiently to build and more efficiently to run the operation at the airport. So all of those things, and I think once the supply chain see the benefit of it from lots of different ways, whether that’s from a safety case or whether that’s from a commercial element.

 

Then I think they will be on board. But I think it’s very difficult sometimes to have one supplier that wants to take the lead because obviously, ultimately, everyone’s going to get the benefit from that. So we do it as a collective, we drive it as Heathrow, and therefore, I think we get the best results that we share the outcome.

 

Seb (10:07)

There’s a couple of kind of key tenants. don’t want to put answers in your mouth, but a couple of key tenants of OSHX. One is that it’s about collaboration. So like you’ve talked about, it’s not just Heathrow saying, I want to go and do some innovation or I want to drive a certain technology, but it’s also not about one part of your supply chain. The idea is bringing everybody together. And that also includes the regulator, who’s also a part of

 

part of the program. There’s an interesting play around the relationship that you might have with a supply chain partner and maybe can you de-risk a technology or help drive a kind of standard. But also I think one of the other interesting things is that safety’s, at least in my view, has kind of existed in this vacuum. And there’s a saying that kind of safety doesn’t sell.

 

Which is both true and not true because there’s lots of scenarios where safety does sell and safety drives radical change. We also see a lot of innovation that focuses on safety that really struggles to get traction. And one of the other kind of core tenets of OSHX is that safety is no longer in this vacuum and the safety, especially in construction and heavy industries is connected to everything from productivity, certainly well-being and resilience of the workforce, but also really basic concepts like efficiency and quality. And you can’t necessarily look at digital transformation only on efficiency without safety, but you also shouldn’t be looking at innovation specifically only on safety without understanding its connection to these bigger

 

possibly more commercially appealing topics. I guess talk a little bit about, you know, maybe why we’re suddenly trying to not look at safety in a vacuum. And one of the ways that we bring people on board is saying, well, we’re looking a lot more holistically. And when you have an innovation, we’ve got to appreciate its value across a number of different levels.

 

Roly (12:25)

Yeah, great question. look, if you go back to some of the principles of health and safety law, you you will talk about what’s everything is reasonably practicable. So the time, cost and effort to put control measure in or get a safety reduction in harm. So I mean, if we live by those principles and that law is still relevant and it is fantastic. You know, if I look in the environment that Heathrow

 

Probably the areas that we could improve our safety on is amongst our baggage handlers and our ground handlers. And it’s a very manual operation. We’ve still got, despite the use of manual handling aids, know our participants still choose to pick suitcases up and then put them in the containers that go into the aircraft hold.

 

Still a very, very manual operation. So they’ll use that. They’ll go out to the stand. They’ve got machines that take them up and they push them into the aircraft hold. Now there’s all of that stuff, which you could say the organisations that are running the operation can turn around and say, well, actually, for me, that’s reasonably practical. We give them training. We give them the right PPE. We give them the right equipment.

 

So actually, at what point do we say that actually investing in a million pounds worth of technology is going to be reasonably practicable? So there’s kind of this juxtaposition around actually that we’re doing everything that we can. But when you start sort of saying, well, actually, do you know what, apart from we talk about moral duties and everything to keep our workforce safe and the longevity of retaining a workforce.

 

I think when you start introducing the commercial benefits into that, into an operation that is very, very commercially tight, because they work on very strict profit margins. And when you start introducing sort of technology that can make that more efficient, give them their workforce and longevity, be more consistent, all of those things. And I think that’s when they’ll start listening and you know because they are commercially driven as opposed to in construction in the areas that we work in they’re probably not you know they I don’t mean that they’re not commercially driven but what I’m saying is is that actually the value of health and safety within construction unfortunately is at a different level to the value of health and safety in some organisations not just at Heathrow but you know around in industry.

 

Because organisations can win or lose a tender in construction on their health and safety. Whether that weighting is kind of equally applied in some other industries, I beg to challenge that. But I think that’s the bit around for me is when you start introducing those conversations about, look, we can guarantee the consistency of your operation by using technology. And at the same time, you’re going to keep people safe.

 

And you’ll probably improve your profit margins over the longer term. So I think that’s when organisations will start thinking. So I think that for me is the great thing about this particular OSHX, this idea. I think that’s the bit where we can really start having some honest conversations and saying that this is intrinsically linked.

 

Seb (16:04)

So Roly my understanding of what OSHX lab is, is that it’s a collaborative innovation program. It’s a technology accelerator where you and your partners in your supply chain and the regulator and other members define the biggest safety challenges.

 

And not just safety challenges in a vacuum, but safety challenges connected to resilience, wellbeing, productivity, and really defining those in some detail. And then going out to the market of global technology suppliers and saying, this is what our needs are, and running an accelerator for those technology companies, bringing them into Heathrow, bringing them into the UK, and hopefully rapidly advancing the amount of technology that’s used for safety in Heathrow, but also possibly other industries.

 

What’s your definition of what OSHX lab is?

 

Roly (16:59)

Great, yes, absolutely spot on Seb with your interpretation. So exactly what my definition of OSHX is, is a group of like-minded people that are coming together to solve some really complex or simple challenges in their own organisations, but actually pooling their knowledge, looking at similar challenges that we want to resolve and coming together to seek the best outcomes, I think, for what we want to do and then encourage the supply chain to adopt what we’ve got. Give the SMEs or whoever comes into solve the challenges the opportunity to sort of trial those in their respective environments and see how we can really push those ideas out to our respective supply chains all across each other’s. So it’s a collaboration group that is going to seek the best outcomes in terms of safety, efficiency, economics and scalability.

 

Seb (17:53)

So we’re going to be linking safety innovation with a whole host of other benefits and concepts around return on investment that maybe it hasn’t been linked to in the past. And in doing so, we’re going to open up to a whole host of new interested parties. It’s on the concept of collaboration. This isn’t just about Heathrow, your supply chain and your delivery partners. It’s also about having

 

Seb (18:22)

the regulator involved, because we know that there can be barriers and almost a lack of understanding or clarity around kind of new technology for safety. But it’s also about saying to other organisations like yourself, I guess, kind of almost come and get involved. So can you kind of outline maybe why you don’t just want to be doing this as Heathrow, but maybe you want other airports or asset owners or contractors or organisations to be joining you on this.

 

Roly (18:51)

Well look, everyone’s going to have their different challenges, I think that’s the, you know, that’s going to be obvious. So we’ve got obviously Heathrow, we’ve got our safety challenges in different areas. I think, you know, the more breadth of organisations you can get involved in the conversation, I think, you know, you can then look at everybody’s challenges, pull them all together and say, well, actually, you know, we’re doing something over here, which will absolutely help you over here. You know, so this, getting a really good sort of mix of challenges, industries, all of those regulators involved. We’ve got, you know, obviously the health and safety executive involved. We’ve got the CAA at Heathrow that we regulate this as well. And we have to abide by sort of European aviation safety as well, which we are. So we’ve got a whole mix of regulators. We’ve got, if we had organisations that are working in the nuclear industry, for example.

 

Or on road works and highways. All of those things would just be kind of, actually, from a commercial perspective as well, the solution could be more commercially viable because you’ve got a lot more people that been buying into that idea or that product or whatever that we produced at the end of this session.

 

 

 

Seb (20:10)

Is it, would it be kind of right to say that actually there’s some really basic concepts around sharing of risk, sharing of ideas, and also economies of scale involved in working with other organisations like yourself, because we know that some of the technology that we’re going to be working with, I wouldn’t call it high risk in terms of a risk to people, but it’s high risk in the sense of we don’t know when it will work or if it will work and there’s risk to you investing time, money and resources into interesting solutions that might fail. But if you do that with other people on combined challenges, then the kind of risk of failure, but the potential benefit is also shared.

 

Roly (20:54)

Absolutely. That’s it. Yeah. So you’re basically, you know, you’re sharing that risk and you’re actually sharing that opportunity as well from what can come out of it. So yeah, economies of scale is the phrase that I was looking for. Thanks.

 

Seb (21:09)

If you had kind of one final message to prospective OSHX lab members, what would your message be?

 

Roly (21:17)

I think it’s a fantastic idea. love to have a conversation with anybody that’s thinking about joining or being part of OSHX. I just think there’s so many similarities, there’s more similarities across all of what we’re trying to solve than differences. So think just being part of that group that collectively is looking at the best outcomes.

 

I think that’s the bit I find really exciting about this is having someone like Safetytech Accelerator and OSHX as that sort of body in the middle is that it takes us out of the day job because we just get involved with stuff at work but having a focus to bring it all together is where I see the benefit of this as well is that it’s more of a focus group.

 

Rather than sort of getting distracted with a day job. So I think, you know, absolutely if anybody is looking to improve, their adoption of technology or, whatever the challenges are from a safety perspective, I think it’s a great opportunity. And as I say, I’m just delighted that Heathrow are part of this. you know, and I think as an organisation it makes me feel proud that Heathrow are part of this. So we’re a forward looking organisation so it’s great and it’s a good opportunity.

 

Seb (22:36)

All right, Roly, thank you very much for your time. It’s always really good to chat. That concludes another episode of Safetytech Accelerator’s Insight Series.